Dating – Courtship

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Should I Stay With My Boyfriend? What About My Family?

April 9, 2010 in Dating - Courtship by JustinS | No comments

Question: “I’ve been dating a guy for three months now; after we had been friends for about five months. It’s kind of been a weird situation because I haven’t brought him around my house very much. Reason being, he’s inactive in the church, a different race, and not the perfect person my parents want me to bring home. He doesn’t have any other wrong things with him except he doesn’t have a career going yet, he still has some schooling to get done. He’s 20, and my parents worry that he isn’t going to be able to support me, keep me faithful, and we will clash from the different ethnic backgrounds. Sometimes it really scares me too because they all seem like legit worries. I’m not worried about his career because I know he’s a hard worker and has a lot of ambition. I’ve freaked out on him a couple of times already and broken up with him twice. I’ve realized that I’m so much in love with him that I feel terrible without him each time and like something is torn away from me. I always want to be with him, even when I know he’s not perfect but I don’t feel like anyone is perfect. I know since I’ve been with him he’s changed from me and become a better person. He will do anything I want him to. But I have this feeling in the pit of my stomach that I’m going to regret everything if we do something drastic, like get married. I feel like we’ll be fighting about religion for the rest of our lives and that seems so upsetting to me. I feel like I’m compromising too much of the way I lead my life, and want to lead my life in the future if I stay with him. But then I think sometimes change is good. I’m worried that if I tell him I have to get married in the temple, therefore we can’t be together, and we break up, I’ll always be missing him and he will be the love of my life that I never got to be with. I’ll be comparing him to every guy I meet. I already go to a therapist right now and she thinks that he’s already been baptized and he’s just inactive, but if he says he’ll go to church with me (the man should always do what the woman wants, religion wise, if he has no other religion he believes in). He says he’d go to church with me. He has no problem doing that. And keeping the sabbath day holy, paying tithing. But he would also want to teach his kids discipline, so he would teach them that drinking is ok, as long as you do it smartly. He doesn’t believe in God and he will not get married in the temple because you have to believe in the church in order to be able to. Basically my therapist thinks I’m worrying and that it’ll all turn out ok, he’s willing to do anything for me because he loves me. I feel really confused and upset. I need other opinions and advice of what to do. What do you think?”

Answer: I am glad you wrote in with your question. It appears that you have a myriad of feelings related to your boyfriend and that you are internally pretty conflicted as to what you should do in terms of the relationship with him. I’ll cover a few points that were apparent in your question that I feel are key for you to understand.

I’d first consider what your parents think of him. How much do you care about what they think? If you really feel their sanction and support is key you might be in for a long haul with him if they are less than supportive of him. That being said, I feel you should do what you want, not what others want or decide to do things to keep your parents happy. You are an adult and the choices you make are yours. Don’t be a slave to their perceptions, if in fact it is true love you’ll regret you fell victim to their thoughts and didn’t follow your heart in staying with him.

You mention religion and spirituality. You speak about your wanting to have a unified relationship but that you are both split on spiritual matters. This likely will become a major concern in later years, especially with kids. His attending church and being a passive participant will likely not last in terms of your hopes for a temple marriage. If you feel he is not or will not marry you in the temple, how much are you willing to risk or wait? If not and you are set on marrying in the temple and you feel he’ll leave you or break up with you if that is your hope then why are you still with him? Again, it’d be helpful for you to make a list of your priorities in rank order of what is most important to you and then gather your thoughts on what you are willing to compromise on and what you won’t. This spirituality issue seems to be a large on that you may not compromise on and if that is the case, I do not recommend marrying him with hopes he’ll come around to what you want. Statistics show and scores of couples I work with indicate that spiritual compliance early on is typical but doesn’t last as living the gospel takes work, time, and internal commitment … his going to please you won’t last so don’t count on his changing on your account.

It is clear that you are internally conflicted about whether to stay or go with him. You said, “I feel like I’m compromising too much of the way I lead my life” and my thought is if you are in fact compromising too much then why are you still with him. Your yielding too much of your core beliefs and values can create a foundation for conflict and tension that is starting now in courtship can grow into a heated distant marriage in the future. Later in your post you said, “I have this feeling in the pit of my stomach that I’m going to regret everything if we do something drastic” I’d follow your heart. You have the capacity to know what works for you and what makes you feel fulfilled and happy. I would not enter into a marriage with trepidation and doubt since jobs, children, etc bring on stresses that test even the best marriages and if you are having serious doubts I would caution you to seriously think through what you really want.

Does he have the characteristics of the man you want to marry and be with here and in eternity? If not what does he have that you value and that you want as a part of the relationship? Clearly you care about him very much and have developed an attachment, based on your verbiage above about your wanting to be with him much of the time. My concern is in your statement, ‘I always want to be with him, even when I know he’s not perfect but I don’t feel like anyone is perfect.’ Yes, nobody is perfect but if he is a good or great person that does not espouse the core attributes and beliefs you feel are key for your future and relationship then I would caution you about subjugating your core beliefs with hope that things will get better as he has his beliefs and they are as real to him as yours are to you and he is entitled to those.

My counsel for you would be to do some writing, make a list of the most significant priorities to you in rank order from most important to least important. Don’t think about the relationship, the attachment, about loving or hurting him, etc. just simply iron out independent of him or others you may date what is key for you. Then make the non-negotiable with the negotiable. Once you have some clarity with what you want stick to that. Marriage is far to wonderful and far to complicated at times to enter into with doubts and concerns like you have raised.

I’d suggest you both take the professional assessment called Relate, something I recommend to couples that are not married but want to flush out what is right for them and the relationship. I’d also recommend your continuing to pray and seek a confirmation. This was developed by therapists at BYU some time ago and has developed into its own institute.

You’re on the right path. Glad you wrote in. Study it out, get some therapeutic guidance, stick to your principles, then make a decision of a direction and don’t look back. Prayer and guidance here is key to your knowing God’s will and hope for you in your journey.

I’d recommend these two articles at links below.

The Voice of the Lord – Gerald N. Lund

Receiving Revelation – Doctrine and Covenants Student Manual

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Sixteen Year Old Daughter – Public Display of Affection?

January 24, 2010 in Parenting, Teenagers by JustinS | 1 comment

Question: “Our 16 year old daughter is very aggressively affectionate towards her 16 year old boyfriend. Her dad and I have talked to her numerous times. She says she doesn’t know what appropriate boundaries are. We’ve talked to him as well and he does understand, commits to keeping the PDA’s to a minimum, but since she is the more aggressive one, he seems to be helpless. She follows his every move, squeezes up against him wherever he is sitting or standing, kissing his face, touching his hair and face, whispering and smiling as though no one else was in the room. We have 4 teens at home. The 18yo daughter also has a boyfriend, but their affection is normal. They’ve both spoken to the 16yo too, but none of our talking is doing any good. The last time we talked, I told her the next time he comes over, she isn’t allowed to be affection at all… a sort of grounding. If she ignores me, I’m going to take him home at the first sign of her inappropriate behavior. I’m also going to insist that she sit down with me and read, “Boundaries for Teens” by Townsend. Hopefully this will help us both understand each other better and maybe she’ll understand better what healthy boundaries are when she reads it by someone else. I also told her that since she has ignored our counsel for months now, she will not be allowed to continue this relationship until she learns to establish healthy boundaries with him and all boys. Am I on the right track? What else can we do?”

Answer: You bring up a common question, how do parents teach adolescents appropriate boundaries, especially in romantic relationships. I’ll attempt to answer your questions and statement in the order you presented them. First of all I doubt that she is unaware of boundaries as she stated. Likely this is merely an “I didn’t know”, kind of justification for her overt public display of affection. Glad you spoke to him, this will help him have some sense of what your expectations are when he is with your daughter yet I am sure he’s confused as he sees that she is boundary-less in some respects. I might add though, to her credit, that she likely is either so infatuated and lost in the relationship with her boyfriend or so clueless to social cues that she to some degree is blind to the display of affection.

From your post it sounds like you are drawing some boundaries yourself with what you feel is and is not appropriate in the home. Now that you’d told her that she is not allowed to show affection to him in your home, have you in fact enforced it? If you have is it working? My thought here is that ‘grounding’ her per se from affection in the home may only encourage her to be ‘all over him’ outside the home. My suggestion would be to have her and him in your home and next time that they are over, I’d bring up the expectations you have in the open. Yes, this’ll heat up things in the kitchen and likely be uncomfortable for them both but again, you’ve laid down the rules and he cannot stop her and she is not listening. I’d confront them both as it is happening, with some comments. Not rude or demeaning or shameful ones but ones that open the topic up when things are happening. Something to another in the room that you are remarking about their behavior like, “Wow, the way Jennie’s got him pinned up against the wall stroking his hair is making me uncomfortable.” or “Jennie, I’ve told you not to make out with John in the kitchen, you know the rules. Will you please manage yourself?” then maybe ask of John something like, “John, how often does this happen with Jennie and is it like that when you are both alone.” Again, yes the questions may seem extreme but the fact is you have given her fair warning enough and she’s not getting the picture. Also, having an open discussion with her and her old siblings of the same gender may help too to do some mentoring and teaching. Yes, you are on the right track. Also, quashing the relationships until she can manager herself is warranted if after you have made multiple attempts to guide, teach, and correct her.

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How Do I Move On After Divorce?

December 10, 2009 in Divorce by JustinS | 2 comments

Question: “How do I move on…… My ex-wife was unfaithful 3 times during our 12 year marriage. First time was just kissing she claimed; second was a one-night-stand and she was disfellowshiped but later was reinstated and we had our 2nd child after that; third time she had a full-blown affair, left home with the children when she fell pregnant to him (she later told me) and then had a abortion due to complications with that pregnancy. She then returned home, confessed all and was excommunicated. Due to that excommunication, she claimed, left home again with the kids secretly when I was working. I did question her probably too much after she was disfellowshiped asking how she could claimed to love me when she went with someone else and after the last time she came back home I questioned her more and openly doubted her story of ‘sorry, I made a mistake with him’ etc. After she left last time, I filled for divorce and obtained it with her absent. That was five years ago. There was never any violence or similar major incidents during our marriage(apart from these infidelities of course) but we did argue almost every week for this or that. I’ve always held a temple recommend, as she did too except during the disciplinary time, and I had many leadership callings in church, as she did too as relief society president(which she was when she was having that affair) and YW leadership, in both ward and stake. Today she is totally inactive with our kids, but I’m still active with temple recommend, calling etc My problem is that I can’t seem to move on. The times I’ve even talked to other single women I ended up feeling guilty and then turn away from them. I’ve turned down several opportunities to date new women. More often than not I find myself praying that she could return or we could get together again, but then later I know its not realistic. I also worry that because the church will not call even a bishop who was once divorced nor is there any GA who was once divorced, I fear that divorcing was a sin which I’ve committed since I filed for it and went through to the end although church leaders say that sometimes divorce is necessary. I’ve read all the related talks available at lds.org, especially Elder Oaks recent one but even then I go through different emotions because when he starts his talk I’ll say Yes, that was me, I needed to divorce but then when he talks to couples who have descended into a marriage in name only and tries to counsel people to not divorce (that it do! isn’t solve any problems etc) then I feel guilty again and inevitably will end up praying again for her to return or for another chance of marriage to her again. I’ve also thought about suicide many times but I end up not doing anything just so the kids will keep receiving their child support payments, and I can still see them too. But usually, I’d say people see me as generally bitter and conflictual possibly stubborn too maybe. Well I’ve written too much now, so the basic question is how do I move on to be able to one day maybe remarry. I know I have to stop hoping for my ex-wife since if not I’ll just be stalking her, if in thought only.”

Answer: Sounds like you have had a really difficult journey. The affairs your former spouse had, the mother of your children, must have really hurt. Dealing with the pain from divorce can be heart wrenching, but more difficult the pain from the infidelity and betrayal by her due to her consistent relationships outside your marriage. The pain for the children must be immense too.

I have a few questions to think about that were not explained in the post. Do you have custody and a relationship with your children? If not, why does she have them solely? From your post, it appears that the marriage was conflict ridden and that there were some problems before or during the affairs she was having. My recommendation here is to process what happened prior to the divorce. The relationship was rocky, or so it appears, and you were hurt, really hurt. I feel your pain when you speak about the 3rd affair and it’s leading you to divorce her.

The bottom line at this point is you are divorced. The marriage is over, the trust is broken due to the betrayal and pain. Your praying that you both can get back together is natural considering this loss for you. Her coming back is unlikely, and if she did she would likely replicate the same patterns in marriage with you again. My suggestion would be that you pray to understand the resistance you have now to dating. Sounds like it has been a few years and you are still hopeful that it will work out and it likely is not. You really need to do some loss and grief work with a therapist. The bonding and attachment are both still alive and are prohibiting you from seeing clearly and dating other women. The internal silent fixed beliefs that you are sinning or that you are hopeless. Clearly is suicide was on your mind as an option or solution you are in pain and need to work through the thought processes that lead you to feelings of despair that culminate in suicide. You also mentioned that you may appear bitter and conflictual with others or at least stubborn. Why would they say this? What are you doing to work on you, to make yourself for of a partner that others would want to be married too? Again, working on you can help you prevent this from happening again in a relationship. It is clear you want to date but the guilt you feel is flowing from faulty beliefs you have about the nature of the divorce. It is as if on some level you are not divorced yet emotionally. The way to do that is to work through the feelings of loss and grief and start healing so that you can prepare your heart and mind for the next relationship. I wrote an article on this topic here.

Glad to hear you have done your own research on divorce and that process from the LDS paradigm. Divorce is not a sin but the Lord does not sanction individuals that quit or close a marriage down due to ‘personality conflicts’ or the like. Gaining guidance and confirmation from the Lord on such matters is requisite prior to making a decision to divorce. I typically do not counsel couples to divorce but to work on their marriage and to seek the Lord. In cases of abuse and the like I counseling people to ensure they are physically and emotionally safe.

My final suggestion for you in addition to the questions you posed is to start working with a counselor and sort through your feelings of loss and grief. Reaching closure and finding meaning is key to your moving forward and will help resolve some of your heartache. Best of luck in your journey.

Additional Resources: Official LDS Church Articles on Divorce as well as YouTube video below

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